Vijesti i novosti o Intel procesorima i čipsetima

[Brko]

Ma jok, "nova" arhitektura bazirana na skylakeu
Samo je i dalje pitanje 10nm, hoće li im uspjeti.

Sent from Usreo Mobara

[The Exiled]

Ili stvarno imaju novi 10nm spreman ili budu dobar stari 14nm dodatno nasvirali, pa ko i svi ostali - jednostavno ga marketing označi kao 10nm i voljno.

Mada nadam se da sad uistinu imaju funkcionalnih 10nm za (masovnu) proizvodnju.

Sunny Cove (2019) is an improved architecture CPU in 10nm -- that'll be the downgraded but hopefully now working 10nm process, might be called 10+ (but it's really 10-...). Willow Cove (2020) is a further optimised Sunny Cove with process tweaks, presumably Intel will call this 10++ but it's based on the same process, it's certainly not 7nm. Golden Cove (2021) is another 10nm CPU with more features, and maybe (going by Intel strategy in the past) some more process tweaks, maybe this will be 10+++? Timescales for 7nm are (according to Intel) completely decoupled from 7nm; logically you'd expect the first 7nm CPUs to emerge in 2022 according to the above dates, but maybe if 7nm really does deliver on-time (unlike 10nm...) the later 10nm CPUs will get canned in favour of 7nm.

There have been various rumours about what Intel are doing to fix their 10nm yield problem, including going from 36nm to 40nm MMP and ditching SAQP for interconnect, removing cobalt for interconnect, and removing COAG (said to have been the reason they couldn't get any GPU yield on the i3-8121U). Whatever the exact truth is, there is bound to be some impact on density below the much-vaunted Intel numbers (probably now similar to or maybe even a bit lower than TSMC), and more to the point relayout of all custom IP (which Intel have a *lot* of) as well as new standard cell and RAM libraries which means a big delay -- normally fundamental layout changes to a process like this need re-characterisation of libraries and IP before products can be taped out. Best guess is that the "new" Intel 10nm process (and products made on it) will be at least a year behind TSMC 7nm even if things go well, which then puts it directly up against TSMC 7nm+ (partial EUV) which will be ~20% denser using the high-density process/libraries, and probably faster (at the same density) than Intel using high-speed process/libraries. Intel must be hoping that their promises of delivering their 7nm process on-time (whatever that means...) using a different team pay off, but it seems impossible that it will catch up with TSMC 5nm which will be in risk production in 2Q2019.

If Zen 2 can be pushed as high as 5GHz it's likely to be because AMD chose high-speed low-density libraries (e.g. 9-track 4-fin with DDB) instead of low-speed high-density ones (e.g. 6-track 2-fin with SDB), together with a performance-oriented metal stack (fewer minimum pitch layers, tapered width higher metal, thick top metal with MIM decoupling) instead of a density-oriented one (more fine-pitch metal, thinner higher metal) --- but all these are elements of the same basic 7nm process, the recipe you choose from the huge bag of ingredients is up to you. Intel would always have used high-performance options, TSMC used to introduce high-density ones first because that was their big customer base, but now they also see HPC/CPU as a priority so are making suitable process options available from the start.

Izvor: SemiWiki Intel 7nm on track forum thread

[The Exiled]

Intel Xeon W-3175X zeigt sich zu Preisen ab 4.100 Euro - duplo skuplji od Threadripper 2990WX modela, a opet duplo jeftiniji od Xeon Platinum 8176.

[Manuel Calavera]

Nema više šamaranja mrtvog magarca tj. skylake refreshiranja i 14nm. Sljedeći intel desktop bi trebao biti nova mikroarhitektura na 10nm, sad dali će se zvati ice lake ili sunny cove nebitno. Očekujem standardnih +5% ipc +/-, ali i pad clocka naspram coffee refresha

[The Exiled]

14nm možda više nema, ali Skylake (i derivati) budu i dalje poslužili kao temelj za dodatnu Sunny Cove optimizaciju. Obzirom da zapravo nisu pokazali ništa novo, već je sve još uvijek obavijeno 10nm misterijom, pitanje je na koju foru su došli ili dolaze iz sfušanog i neiskoristivog 10nm procesa, u ovaj "novi" 10nm s kojim budu daljnje tri-četiri godine plasirali sve svoje proizvode na tržište.

[Eladio]

još par info o sunny cove-u : Intel Chief Core Architect on Spectre/Meltdown, Sunny Cove, & 10nm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0s6zMQgkjGs

[The Exiled]

Mora se priznati da Intelov marketing zna kaj radi:

Sunny Cove | Willow Cove | Golden Cove: to be very clear here, these are the codenames for the individual core microarchitecture, not the chip, which is an important departure from how Intel has previously done things.

Ko bi rekel, čisto da se dodatno zbuni sve i svakoga.

So where does this leave us in terms of Sunny Cove predicted performance compared to Skylake at a clock for clock level? Unfortunately we don’t have enough information.

OoO 5.0GHz+ all-Sunny-Cove-core CPU?

Intel confirmed that Ice Lake will be built using Sunny Cove cores. But Intel also showed off what they said was an Ice Lake Xeon 10nm processor and package.

Color me skeptical, but what was held up is likely either not ICL-SP or just silicon that doesn’t work.

Dakle, ni novinari koji su bili na tom druženju, na kraju dana još uvijek ne znaju ništa konkretno. Bilo bi za očekivati da će Intel, ako stvarno imaju "novih" 10nm svim okupljenima pokazati aposlutno sve, ne samo razvojne ploče za 15W Ice Lake U i svoju ARM big.LITTLE verziju. Tim više, jer kad Intel uistinu ima nove proizvode na novoj mikroarhitekturi i novom (ili poboljšanom) proizvodnom procesu onda to izgleda kao Sandy Bridge (1 - 2) ili Haswell predstavljanje, isto kao što je AMD napravil za Zen+ CES Tech Day. Nerijetko je Intel koristil IDF za najavu stvari koje su dolazile godinu-dvije kasnije, a sad ne žele dati izravan odgovor na pitanja oko "novog" 10nm procesa, ali hej 7nm samo što nije, jer je zapravo razvijan paralelno s prošlim, starim i propalim 10nm procesom, koji opet nije baš takav fijasko da ne bi poslužil za "novi i poboljšani" 10nm Sunny Cove i društvo.

Dabog da je sve kaj su rekli o tom novom 10nm procesu istina, u suprotnom...

[Smartic]

Ovo mi se čini ko da su sve požurili mjesec dana samo zbog Zen 2 leakova i polupripremljeno najavili sve i svašta umjesto na CESu.

[The Exiled]

Bome i to kaj veliš, a i Intel je u polupripremljeno modu od izlaska prve Ryzen generacije. Da nije, početkom 2019. bi tek čitali recenzije o Core i7-8700K. Nema jebene šanse da bi u međuvremenu sve ovo izašlo na vidjelo.

[Manuel Calavera]

Oni već neko vrijeme imaju polupripremljene tj. požurene najave tako da to nije ništa novo.
Uglavnom ništa se nije promjenilo u starom roadmapu - ice lake je dakle naziv za cijeli čip, sunny cove naziv za jezgre...

[The Exiled]

No surprises if Intel quits contract chipmaking market

Intel's recent announcement about refocusing its manufacturing resources on its own products has raised speculation again that the company may discontinue its so-called custom foundry business. Intel has been in the contract chipmaking maket for years, but has not been really devoting much to competing against TSMC and Samsung. The firm's foundry service, which asks for higher prices than competitors', exists in name only, with no major clients or large orders recorded. Over the past two years, speculations about Intel likely to quit the contract manufacturing sector have kept appearing, but the company has never responded to them.

At its Technology and Manufacturing Day in 2017, Intel promised that it would help clients access the firm's technology and manufacturing resources by providing them with turnkey services covering chip design, fabrication, packaging and testing. The company has since launched diverse all-function design platforms associated with its 22nm, 14nm and 10nm FinFET processes to serve customers, reportedly prompting many firms to build partnerships with Intel, including LG Electronics seeking to create a world-class mobile platform based on Intel's 10nm process. But the release of Intel's 10nm platform has been long delayed, with the likelihood that it will not come till the second half of 2019. This has not only disrupted the advance of Intel's own products to 10nm, but has also tightened the supply of 14nm and 22nm CPUs to customers, in addition to LG's mobile platform roadmap affected by the delay.

Izvor: DigiTimes

[piydek]

Sunny Cove čitam kao malu misterioznu kutijicu, čija jedina (što implicitna, što eksplicitna marketinška) poruka je "Imamo genijalan CPU koji je nešto novo iz Intelove radionice i dolazi uskoro. Nemojte kupovati AMD. Čekajte naš genijalni novi proizvod. The bestest ever.". Napuhivanje balona kojem je funkcija da na temelju svojeg imidža i marketinga naprave što mogu sad protiv AMDa.

[The Exiled]

Da, tak se čini, a da sapunica bude potpuna - Intel nastavlja s regrutiranjem svega i svakoga tko je voljan na prebjeg. Jedino još M. Night Shyamalan nije najavil prelazak u Intel. Svi ostali su već dobili službene propusnice.

[Manuel Calavera]

Znači PCPer ode u kuratz, mada su dosta raskrinkani zadnjih godina (shillovanje s Intelom preko privatne firme Ryana Schrouta, nešto slično ovoj Principled Technologies shemi, samo još gore jer se to prebacilo i na PCPer).

Inače ovaj Malventano je jedan od najboljih recenzenata ssd-a, diskova općenito. Vjerojatno bi mogao raditi nešto na području ssd-a, intel optanea i sl. stvarima

[The Exiled]

Ko zna, možda i njih na kraju netko kupi i stavi pod istu kapu kao i AnandTech i Tom's Hardware. Jeff Kampman je nedavno također mahnul svima koji su ga zadnjih godina čitali u sklopu The Tech Reporta. Kaj se samog Ryana Shrouta tiče, iskreno nemam pojma koja bi njegova (Chief Performance Strategist) uloga mogla biti u Performance Strategy Group diviziji - osim naravno one marketinške. Ken Addison pak piše o svemu pomalo, tak da bi se i on mogel snaći u PR vodama. Allyn Malventano je kak i veliš, definitivno specijaliziran za sve vezano uz diskove, tak da bi od njega i mogla biti konkretna korist.

I have accepted a role at Intel as the company’s Chief Performance Strategist. In this capacity, I will help influence and drive performance leadership across Intel’s product portfolio.

Možda PCPer ekipa zna na koju foru je Intel osposobil 10nm za Sunny Cove.

[Manuel Calavera]

Ma vjerojatno PR u odnosima sa bivšim kolegama (novinarima), a Malventano možda i nešto korisno. Pogledaj što je recimo Fractal napravio sa PR na youtubeu sa onim Fractal Josh tipom. Tip iskače iz paštete, frend je sa svima, 95% konfi se slaže u fractal, sponzor su svakom jačem yt kanalu i imaju daleko najjači imidž, barem na toj yt platformi.

[The Exiled]

2018 Semiconductor Year in Review: Process Delays at Intel

In 2007 Intel introduced their 45nm process, the world’s first production process with high-K metal gates (HKMG), In 2009 Intel introduced 32nm and then in 2011 their 22nm process, the world’s first production FinFET process. 14nm was originally expected in 2013 but didn’t ramp until 2014 due to yield issues. After the 14nm delay expectations for intel reset to a 3-year cadence and 10nm was expected in 2017. Intel did ship a few 10nm parts at the end of 2017, but production is now expected to be late 2019 once again due to yield issues. Intel’s 10nm has slightly denser logic than the first-generation foundry 7nm processes and Intel is paying the price for the aggressive shrink they attempted. Both Samsung and TSMC went from 16nm/14nm to 10nm and then 7nm while Intel went from 14nm to their “10nm” process in a single step, a 2.7x density increase. There has been a lot of speculation that in order to fix the 10nm yield issues Intel will relax the density specifications, I continue to believe the process that is due to ramp up next year will have the same density previously announced (this is also what Intel is saying).

Intel is now reportedly exiting the custom foundry business. Frankly I never took Intel seriously in foundry, they have always introduced their microprocessor processes a year or more before they offered a foundry version at the same node, if they were serious about foundry the foundry process would have come out at the same time. I do not however see Intel abandoning their own internal manufacturing as some have speculated. Intel has started equipping their moth-balled Fab 42 as the lead 7nm production fab and they recently announced fab expansions in Oregon, Israel and Ireland.

Intel is currently working on 7nm due in 2020. Intel 7nm is targeted as a 2.4x shrink from their 10nm process. Based on the announcements and rumors surrounding Samsung’s 5nm process due in 2019, 4nm process in 2020 and 3nm process in 2021 and TSMC’s 5nm process due in 2019 and 3nm process forecast for around 2021, these processes will be relatively modest shrinks and we expect that if Intel achieves the target shrink their 7nm process will be as dense or denser than the foundry 3nm processes. The question is can they hit their 2020 target. Intel has commented on a conference call that they believe by introducing EUV at 7nm they think the 2.4x shrink is achievable. My concern is a 2.4x shrink will be really pushing a lot of device limits and I would not be surprised to see 7nm delayed. Even if Intel is delayed to 2021 or even 2022 they will once again have competitive density with the foundries.

• What’s The Right Path For Scaling?
  
  
• der8auer proves that Intel’s LGA-1151v2, Z370 and Z390 are pointless
  
  

  Autor The Exiled

  Intel Xeon W-3175X zeigt sich zu Preisen ab 4.100 Euro - duplo skuplji od Threadripper 2990WX modela, a opet duplo jeftiniji od Xeon Platinum 8176.

• The Price of Intel’s Unlocked 28-Core Xeon W-3175X: OEM Tells us ‘around $8k’
  
  
• IEDM 2018: Intel’s 10nm Standard Cell Library and Power Delivery

Izvor: SemiWiki, Semiconductor Engineering i PC Builder's Club

[Manuel Calavera]

Ice Lake
Intels new 9th gen desktop cpus i3-9350kf i5-9400f i5-9400 i5-9600kf i7-9700kf i9-9900kf

[domina]

Intel već, koliko, 4-5 gen nije izdao novi igp?
Definitivno uzimam ryzena.

[The Exiled]

Broadwell C i R modeli su svojevremeno imali odličan Iris Pro iGPU, dok bi "novi 10nm" Sunny Cove iGPU trebal biti još bolji (skok sa 48EU na 64EU). Naravno, ostaje pitanje u kakvom rangu budu ta nova rješenja u odnosu na sadašnje i nadolazeće Ryzen iGPU-ove, ali ako ništ drugo - Intel je iz generacije u generaciju dodaval sve bolju podršku za multimediju. Izuzev Iris Pro modela, sirova snaga u igrama im i nije bila nešto posebno, ali multimedija je do dana današnjeg uredno imala prednost.

[Manuel Calavera]

Ovi su poludili

Intel Possibly Readying Core i9-9990XE Processor – Rocks 14 Cores, Up To 5.0 GHz Frequency at 255W TDP

The Core i9-9990XE is said to rock a base clock of 4.0 GHz (+ 1.0 GHz over the Core i9-9980XE) and a 5.0 GHz boost clock (+ 0.5 GHz over the Core i9-9980XE). This would allow for much better work load and gaming performance than the existing flagship. The chip would retain support for DDR4-2666 MHz memory and 44 PCIe Gen 3.0 lanes. The other detail here is that the chip would be a hog in terms of power consumption with a rated TDP of 255W. This alone shows that you’d require a good X299 motherboard for the best stability with this processor.

The TDP jump over the Core i9-9980XE is of 90W and there are only a few X299 motherboards that can handle such higher TDP number chips. Also worth noting is that a 14 core part, the i9-9940X already exists in the lineup with a price tag of around $1400 US. The Core i9-9990XE being much faster may end up with a hefty price tag. We expect that the pricing can fall around the $2000 US range, same as the Core i9-9980XE. This would allow Intel to see both parts, a faster clocked and a higher core configured part at the same value. But whether they will be able to keep up with the competition remains to be seen until reviews arrive which for this type of processor would be very limited.

Jebo me pas ako oni ovo nisu većinom predvidjeli za neke "extremne" gaymer/streamere

[thunderbird]

Koliko je ono FX9590 TDP-a imao i topio matične?

[Manuel Calavera]

Uračunaj još da tdp nije isto što i potrošnja...


Evo i9 9900K "95w" tdp cpu, a 2950X (16c32t) je "180w tdp" cpu u sistemskoj potrošnji.






Razlika dupla naspram "tdp 65w" brandiranih, a u ovih 116w od i5 8400 se ne odnosi sve na potrošnju cpu-a, dok sva razlika do i9 jest do cpu-a...
Tako da... moglo bi biti veselo...

[Blue Spirit]

Jesam fulao meme ili ... ?



Someone last hurrah is their last period of influence or power.

[The Exiled]

The New Intel CEO: Will Headless Intel Woo AMD’s Lisa Su?

It is my sincere hope that the new CEO will be the start of a technology renaissance at Intel. Unfortunately, there is only one candidate of the rumored five that has a chance in my opinion and that is Johny Srouji. Prior to Apple (pre 2008) Johny worked for Intel Israel (14 years) and IBM (6 years), so yes he has Intel experience but I would not call him an Intel insider. The other rumored candidates are Lisa Su (CEO of AMD), Navin Shenoy (Intel), Murthy Renduchintala (QCOM/Intel), and Diane Bryant (Ex Intel). All of whom I don’t personally see succeeding but Lisa Su would be my choice out of the four. Bottom line: The next Intel CEO MUST be an outsider! I remember stating some time ago that Intel should buy NVIDIA just to get their CEO but of course they didn’t which clearly was a mistake.

Hopefully the Intel CEO question will be answered on the conference call next week. The Intel CEO search started last June which to me is a very long time to be without a leader. When I ask them about the CEO debacle most just shake their heads. One thing that they all agree on is that BK did not deserve the ousting he got and another thing that most agree on is that if Murthy gets the CEO job Intel resumes will hit the streets. Just the opposite if Johny is hired, expect an influx of resumes from just about every company in the semiconductor community to hit his desk, absolutely.

Izvor: SemiWiki i EE Times

[Gigi1]

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/ms...amd,38473.html

Sreca da intel ima problema sa stancanjem jer pitanje bi li se u suprotnom amd usppio tak probiti s obzirom da je ceo msi(a vj.i ceo-vima ostalih brandova) bed reci da bi oni htjeli vise amd, a manje intela.

Free market howyesno

Amd ide na 7nm za 5mj. a ovi nemaju konkretne planove...ko HR vlada-ruka ruku mije.

[Brko]

Dovoljno se samo sjetiti štancanja Z270 ploča i koliko ih je ostalo po raznim skladištima, dok u isto vrijeme AM4 ploča nije bilo ni za lijek i bile su poluproizvodi.

Svi ti CEOvi su fine pare dobili nekad prije, možda još i dobivaju pa moraju čkomiti, al evo ovaj MSI-jev malo kao da se oslobodio iako sve nešto fino popreko i u rukavicama.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

[Amd_Shill]

Autor Drug Brko

Dovoljno se samo sjetiti štancanja Z270 ploča i koliko ih je ostalo po raznim skladištima, dok u isto vrijeme AM4 ploča nije bilo ni za lijek i bile su poluproizvodi.

Svi ti CEOvi su fine pare dobili nekad prije, možda još i dobivaju pa moraju čkomiti, al evo ovaj MSI-jev malo kao da se oslobodio iako sve nešto fino popreko i u rukavicama.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

Zato sto je malo ko ocekivao da ce Zen biti tako dobar.

[sakomako]

Autor Amd_Shill

Zato sto je malo ko ocekivao da ce Zen biti tako dobar.

A što ih spriječava da imaju ploču u pripremi, pa ako vide da stvar ide i da je dobra da malo odrade prekovremeno i naštancaju onoliko koliko tržište traži? Valjda netko od tih CEO prati kooliko koji proizvođač CPU izbacuje komada, a to onda treba negdje i upiknuti da bi radilo.



Stvari se danas rješavaju u par dana, a mjesec je već predugačko razdoblje za tako nešto. Imati ploču u pripremi je jedno, a krenuti u masovnu proizvodnju nešto sasvim drugo što se tiče troškova.



Pa hebiga ili jesu kapitalisti ili nisu, nije to socijalizam.



Na kraju oni koji su sposobni opstaju na tržištu, a ostali odlaze u zaborav, tako svijet danas funkcionira, od plakanja nema ništa ili se prilagodiš ili te nema.

[Manuel Calavera]

Mislim ono pazi ovu rečenicu:

Relationship with Intel: Chiang told us that, given Intel's strong support during the shortage, it would be awkward to tell Intel if he chose to come out with an AMD-powered product. "It's very hard for us to tell them 'hey, we don't want to use 100 percent Intel,' because they give us very good support," he said. He did not, however, make any claims that Intel had pressured him or the company.

Što je to "good support"? Pinka?


Kao da slušamo nekog političara, a ne biznismena koji bi pravio sve što se želi prodati...


Pa sjetite se i onog nvidijinog "partner programa" - svi "multiplatform" AiB su se ukrcali na taj brod (asus, msi, gigabyte)