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PR3DA70R 19.04.2025. 18:57

E pa stvar je u tome što i je i nije. To je ono što govorim. Zavisno što je pod opterećenjem. CPU+GPU / samo CPU / samo GPU.
Temperatura CPU nije ništa manja ako se ciljano testira samo CPU, tj ako je samo CPU pod opterećenjem.

Radijator side mounted neće grijati GPU, jer GPU dobiva svjež zrak iz vana od donja 3 ventilatora. Ali će GPU grijati radijator (tj. CPU) ako je top mounted jer je jedini put topline kroz radijator na vrhu. Topal zrak od radijatora sa strane tehnički ne ide preko grafičke i ne utječe gotovo uopće na njezinu temepraturu, praktički ide direktno u smjeru gore a ne lijevo na grafu kao što svi misle. Razmeš? :)

Nisam baš razumio pitanje jer si napisao pump/crijeva. Pumpa je tu najvažniji faktor, zbog pumpe je bitna orijentacija. Pitaš ako bi pumpa trebala biti na najvišoj točki ili?
Za cijevi najvažnije čega se treba držati da vrh radijatora nije ispod razine pumpe. Pa čak niti da je na istoj razini nije baš poželjno. Pumpa ne smije biti najviša točka u odnosu AIO hladnjaka u cjelini općenito.

Chuck Norris 01.05.2025. 17:29

Ryzen 9 9950x3d
 
Pozdrav,


imam novi kompjuter:


CPU AMD Ryzen 9 9950X3D
MBO Gigabyte X870E Aorus Elite WiFi7
RAM G.Skill Trident Z5 NEO RGB AMD Expo, 64 GB (2x32), DDR5 6000 MHz, CL30
SSD Samsung 9100 Pro, 2 TB, M.2 NVMe PCIe Gen5, R14700/W13300

GFX Gigabyte AMD Radeon RX9070XT Aorus Elite OC, 16 GB GDDR6
PSU Be QUIET! Dark Power 13, 1000W, 80+ Titanium, modular, ATX
COOLER BE QUIET! Silent Loop 3 420 mm
SOUND Creative SoundBlasterX AE-5 Plus, 5.1, PCIe
CASE BE QUIET! Shadow Base 800 FX, E-ATX, RGB, glass, black (ukupno 5 Light Wings 1500 RPM fanova)


Malo sam se igrao s postavkama u BIOS-u (PBO):


PPT 280000
EDC 180000
TDC 180000
Core voltage offset negative 15


Cinebench mi je dao nakon toga (bez izmjena je islo do 84-85 c multicoreu i rezultat oko 43500-43600):


Multi core - 43132 - peaking 75 c 1 min
Single core - 2274 - peaking 57 c 1 min


Multi core - 43013 - peaking 76 c 10 min
Single core - 2287 - peaking 56 c 10 min


Multi core - 43168 - peaking 77 c 30 minutes
Single core - 2279 - peaking 57 c 30 minutes

S -20 offsetom je davalo bolji rezultat (identican onome bez izmjena), ali nakon duzeg opterecenja bi se smrznuo sustav, pa sam smanjio na -15 i radio sve ove testove iznad - bez rusenja.


GPU sam izmjenio voltazu na -80 u Adrenalinu te boostao memory clock na cca 2700 MHz. To mi je dalo:


- 7689 u Steel Nomad testu i 28518 (32398 graphics, 16990 CPU) u TimeSpy testu. Furmark isto dao dobre rezultate s hotspotom do 85 c (prije undervoltanja je islo preko 90 c).


Sto se tice fan curvea:


- Ventilatori kucista i coolera - 40% na 40 c, 50% na 60 c, 70% na 70 c, 85% na 80 c i 100% na 85 c. Hysteresis 5 c i response 1 s.

- Pumpa 80% od 40 do 60 c, a od 60 c 100%.
- GPU - 20% na 30 c, 36% na 50 c, 52% na 56 c, 68% na 63 c i 100% na 70 c.


Zero fan je iskljucen na GPU jer mi se temperatura SSD-a dizala preko 50 ako ne rade fanovi.


Sve navedeno daje mi otprilike ove temperature na idle (uz ambijentalnu od cca 25 c):


CPU (Tctl/Tdie) 48 c
CCD1 33c
CCD2 33c
Sve jezgre 28-30 c
L3 Cache (CCD 1 i 2) oko 30 c
CPU IOD Hotspot 48 c
CPU IOD Average 41 c
CPU VDDCR_VDD VRM 48 c
CPU VDDCR_SOC VRM 47 c
CPU VDD_MISC VRM 50 c
Chipset 1 47 c
Chipset 2 51 c
System1 32 c
PCH 50 c
PCIEX16 40 c
VRM MOS 46 c
DDR 5 DIMM 1 SPD Hub temperature 39 c
DDR 5 DIMM 2 SPD Hub temperature 38 c
SSD Drive temperature 42 c
SSD Drive temperature 2 44 c
SSD Drive temperature 3 42 c
GPU Temperature 32 c
GPU Memory junction temperature 56 c
GPU VR VDDC temperature 37 c
GPU hotspot temperature 34 c
GPU VR SoC temperature 39 c
GPU Hot spot temperature (max) 34 c
GPU (internal) Temperature 42 c

Zanima me najvise treba li me brinuti idle od CPU-a? Negdje pise da je to sasvim normalno, negdje da je mrvicu poviseno...

Fanovi su tihi po ovim postavkama i ne bi povecavao RPM-ove jer s tim dobijem mozda 1 c razlike, a to je nista.

Naravno, dobrodosli su i drugi savjeti. Hvala! :)

tomek@vz 01.05.2025. 17:42

https://i.imgflip.com/8tjmto.jpg

vacs 01.05.2025. 23:56

Radi usporedbe jer imamo isti defaultni tdp...meni je na 7900x pbo na -25 i tdp lockan na 135w, dobijem 6% veci score nego na defaultu, tako da si probaj skinuti tdp i vidi sto ce biti

U idlu je 39-41 stupanj, stoga da ja imam arctic liquid freezer III pro 360, ventove sam lockao na 20%, a pumpu na 40%, max u loadu mi stupanj vise nego kad su ventovi i pumpa na full-u, tj 77 stupnjeva

Isto kod grafe, stavio sam ventove na 35%, hotspot mi je sa 86 skocio na 90, ali me ne ubija buka vise. Radi se o 7900xt, undervoltana -70, core 3200mhz, memorija 2750mhz, timmings na fast...score +9%

Btw jesi stavio zadnji bios i zadnje chipset drivere s amd stranice? Mozda ti se smrzava na -20 jer imas neku stariju nestabilniju verziju

The Exiled 12.05.2025. 15:47

Citiraj:

AMD Ryzen AI Max+ PRO 395 Linux Benchmarks: Outright Incredible Performance + Radeon 8060S Linux Graphics Performance:kafa:
Citiraj:

The AMD Ryzen AI Max+ PRO 395 can work out fine on modern Linux distributions: as long as you're on a modern distribution like say Fedora Workstation 42 or Ubuntu 25.04 you should find the support in good standing. As long as you are on a somewhat recent Linux kernel version you should be in good shape for the compatibility/support while for the Strix Halo graphics obviously the newer the kernel and the newer the Mesa release will mean a better graphics experience. HP has kindly sent over their ZBook Ultra 14-inch G1a mobile workstation: it's a beast being powered by the top-end AMD Ryzen AI Max+ PRO 395 SoC with 16 cores / 32 threads and powerful integrated Radeon 8060S graphics, 128GB of system memory, a nice 14-inch 2.8K display, and other top-end features to provide a dominating laptop powerhouse.

Simply put, the AMD Ryzen AI Max+ PRO 395 delivers incredible performance potential that need it on the go. For those running heavy workloads from your laptop for portability, convenience, travel, or similar purposes, the AMD Ryzen AI Max+ PRO 395 opens a whole new realm of performance while still delivering good power efficiency. On average the AMD Ryzen AI Max+ PRO 395 was 1.42x the performance of the AMD Ryzen AI 9 HX 370 "Strix Point". Or a whopping 1.88x the performance of Intel Lunar Lake. But that's just the geo mean. If really diving into AI, code compilation, scientific computing, and other creator workloads and more the AMD Ryzen AI Max+ PRO 395 was commonly at 2x the performance or more of the high-end Strix Point SoCs.
Izvor: Phoronix
EDIT:
Citiraj:

  • AVX-512 performance + power efficiency shines with AMD Strix Halo
    Citiraj:

    When taking the geometric mean of more than 100 AVX-512 capable software packages/applications, having AVX-512 enabled as is the default meant 1.46x the performance compared to force-disabling AVX-512 on Strix Halo. AVX-512 provides very meaningful performance gains on AMD Zen 5 (and Zen 4) from AI workloads to scientific computing, video coding, JSON parsing, and other software able to leverage Advanced Vector Extensions 512. Meanwhile Intel's latest laptop and desktop processors do not support AVX-512. Very important for AMD Strix Halo laptops is that AVX-512 doesn't lead to any increase in power use. In fact, when looking at the CPU power consumption over the entire span of 100+ benchmarks carried out, AVX-512 disabled on the Ryzen AI MAX+ PRO 395 led to a 53 Watt average and with the default AVX-512 enabled state was a 51 Watt average for the SoC.
  • ROCm GPU compute performance with AMD Ryzen AI MAX+ "Strix Halo"
    Citiraj:

    Across 50+ benchmarks when taking the geometric mean for the workloads tested on all three laptops, the Ryzen AI MAX+ PRO 395 within the HP ZBook Ultra G1a was at 2.41x the performance of the popular Ryzen AI 9 HX 370 "Strix Point" SoC found within the Framework Laptop 13. 2.41x! Over the Intel Xe2 graphics within Lunar Lake was also 2.3x the performance, which would have been even worse off if not for last week's Compute Runtime release enhancing Lunar Lake with ULLS and other optimizations. Across the range of GPU compute benchmarks carried out, the Ryzen AI MAX+ PRO 395 had a 43 Watt average and a peak of 77 Watts. The Ryzen AI 9 HX 370 had a 23 Watt average and a 50 Watt peak while the Core Ultra 7 256V had a 15 Watt average and a 28 Watt peak. So going from Strix Point to Strix Halo with these ROCm GPU compute workloads had 1.87x the SoC power use but delivering around 2.4x the performance for a nice efficiency win.


The Exiled 29.05.2025. 18:20

ASRock failures face-to-face: Motherboards, BIOS, & burned 9800X3D CPUs:kafa:
Citiraj:

“No, we’re not saying it’s an AMD issue. We found that it should be related to our BIOS setting — that’s the PBO settings, Precision Boost Overdrive. More technically, we adjusted two main settings in PBO. One is TDC (Thermal Design Current) and the other is EDC (Electrical Design Current). We found that our original values for these two settings might have been too high. So now, with BIOS version 3.25, we lowered the PBO values. We believe this can solve the problem.” There’s another concerning issue. Some users on Reddit have reported that their processors died even after updating to BIOS version 3.25. Steve also noted cases where users experienced CPU failures despite not enabling PBO at all. Nevertheless, ASRock continues to assert that PBO settings are the root cause.

Disco 02.06.2025. 11:53

Ovo su rekli i TechYesu, ali imam neki filing da ni sami ne znaju jer ako sam dobro shvatio, ovo je već treća stvar koju su promijenili vezano uz ubijanje zen5.

The Exiled 07.08.2025. 19:30

Citiraj:

Framework desktop with AMD Ryzen AI Max offers excellent, Linux-friendly performance + AMD Ryzen AI Max+ 395 vs. Ryzen 9 9950X vs. Ryzen 9 9950X3D:chears:
Citiraj:

When taking the geometric mean of all the raw 200+ performance benchmarks, the Ryzen AI Max+ 395 on Ubuntu 25.04 Linux was running at 95% the speed of the Ryzen 9 9950X and at 89% of the Ryzen 9 9950X3D with 3D V-Cache. The Ryzen AI Max+ 395 was consuming 91 Watts on average during the 200+ benchmarks with a peak of 119 Watts. The Ryzen 9 9950X had a 154 Watt average and 205 Watt peak while the Ryzen 9 9950X3D had a 171 Watt average and 212 Watt peak. The AMD Ryzen AI Max+ 395 being able to deliver 95% the performance of the Ryzen 9 9950X overall for CPU-based workloads while consuming just 59% the power on average is quite impressive with the Ryzen 9000 series already being in good shape for power efficiency relative to other desktop processors. The Ryzen AI Max+ 395 at 89% the performance of the Ryzen 9 9950X3D came in at 53% the CPU power consumption on average.
Izvor: Phoronix

zvonac 08.08.2025. 12:00

Ryzen AI Max+ 395, bome graf.performanse su u rangu solidne grafe.
Pun pogodak amd. Nadam se da ce taj proc imat vecu lepezu izbora laptopa a ne samo asus rog flow 13.

Disco 09.08.2025. 09:01

Citiraj:

Autor zvonac (Post 3816188)
Ryzen AI Max+ 395, bome graf.performanse su u rangu solidne grafe.
Pun pogodak amd. Nadam se da ce taj proc imat vecu lepezu izbora laptopa a ne samo asus rog flow 13.

Treba samo računati na super cijenu, AI 370 uređaji su većinom 1200€+, ne bi me čudilo da ovo bude 1500+.:chears::beer:

Problem 09.08.2025. 13:57

Dal se 9950x na 105w tpd ponaša jednako efikasno kao 7950x?

The Exiled 09.08.2025. 20:55

Da, 9950X se ponaša podjednako efikasno.:)
EDIT:
Citiraj:

Autor Problem (Post 3816437)
Znači, curve optimiser -15 all core i ECO 105W i prst u uho?

Nisam odmah skužil ovaj dio posta, ali da, s tim da Curve Optimiser možeš podesiti i općenito koristiti kak god ti najbolje odgovara.

Problem 10.08.2025. 16:23

To je ok. Javim se sa novom konfom kada stigne :D

Znači, curve optimiser -15 all core i ECO 105W i prst u uho?

Problem 21.08.2025. 00:23

Evo,

stigla nova kanta:

Ryzen 9950x + NH-D15
MSI MAG x870 Tomahawk
256GB RAM
RTX5080

u biosu mi je ECO mode disejblan i jedino što sam napravio je curve optimiser, all core -15

U CB23 dobivam 41613 all core, s max temp od 85°C nakon 10min. Je to ok?,

Ne ganjam score, bitna mi je stabilnost i temp...

p.s. za sve koji se češkaju po glavi i misle si čemu tolko rama - 3D lasersko skeniranje i fotogrametrija ;)

The Exiled 21.08.2025. 00:35

Vredu je to, glavno da ti sve radi kak spada.

Problem 21.08.2025. 00:40

Onda više ne prčkam :D

Dopuna, ipak sam prčkao :D

Nasao sam tdp limit i kada stavim na 120w, co -15, temp je ugodnih 75 max, ali i performanse u real world testiranju cca 10% slabije. Zavrsio sam na tome da je tdp po difoltu, co -20 i temp sam ogranicio na 80. Rezultati prakticki isti kao kada je sve po difoltu, a hladniji.

Kada je bio samo co -15 all core, u c23 nije isla temp preko 85, al je isla do 95 u fotogrametriji.

Sad vise ne diram za ozbiljno :)

Mladenxy 21.08.2025. 20:16

https://wccftech.com/amd-clarifies-a...nout-concerns/

zvonac 21.08.2025. 21:02

Pozdrav. Slažem konfu pa trebam mišljenje.. Prioritet je stavljen na stabilnost i temperature tj potrošnja sistema. Traži se "rock solid" konfa.

U pitanju je 9700X i Asus Rog Strix B850-F Gaming+G.Skill Trident (32gb) 6000 CL30.
Pretpostavljam da je ta kombinacija ok? Jel postoje kakve mušice i sl s tom pločom, memorijom i procom u pogledu trzanja, nestabilnosti i sl?

The Exiled 22.08.2025. 10:18

OK su te komponente, a stabilnost ionak dodatno ovisi o postavkama koje namjeravaš koristiti, odnosno da baš ne ostaviš sve na auto i default u BIOS-u.:)

The Exiled 28.08.2025. 16:19

Citiraj:

ASRock releases 3.40 BIOS for AMD 800 series motherboards, addressing “CPU operating stability”:kafa:
Citiraj:

It’s been reported that ASRock has issued a new BIOS, version 3.40, across its AMD 800-series motherboard lineup. This update arrives more than two months after the previous release and nearly three months after ASRock began acknowledging user reports. ASRock’s AMD 800-series motherboards have been linked to damage affecting Ryzen 9000X3D CPUs. AMD recently admitted that the issue was not on their side, pointing instead to motherboard manufacturers exceeding recommended specifications. ASRock has never took full responsibility for the CPU damage, often downplaying the reports and issuing unusual press statements suggesting that cleaning the socket would fix the issue. They did, however, mention that their BIOS settings might have contributed to the problem.

That “fix” clearly did not resolve the problem for CPUs that were permanently damaged, which appear to be more vulnerable on ASRock boards. Reports continue to surface almost daily on Reddit, indicating that the previous BIOS update clearly failed to address the issue. The new 3.40 BIOS may finally target this problem. ASRock claims the update improves stability for both CPU and memory, though the release notes provide no details on what was changed. Users are generally advised not to flash a new BIOS if their system is stable, but given the ongoing risks, leaving it untouched may not be safe either. We recommend updating the BIOS or, at minimum, waiting for early feedback from other users to see if the new version introduces fixes or changes.
Izvor: VideoCardz

PR3DA70R 28.08.2025. 23:11

Ja sam još uvijek na 3.15 i strah me mrdnut dalje jer mi savršeno radi. :D

Odinarius 29.08.2025. 11:07

Time to update.

PR3DA70R 29.08.2025. 15:19

Malo ću pričekati da vidim kakav će feedback biti za tu zadnju verziju.

Tajl3r 29.08.2025. 15:49

Ma nema šanse nek stoji orđiđi

Poslano sa mog SM-S918B koristeći Tapatalk

tomek@vz 30.08.2025. 06:58

Citiraj:

AMD is addressing mounting concerns over socket burnouts tied to its AM5 platform after a spate of high-profile failures drew attention to certain third-party motherboards, particularly those made by Asrock. The company acknowledged that deviation from its recommended BIOS settings among some vendors has contributed to the problem, though the cause may be more complex than a single misstep in board tuning.

> Techspot

Exy 31.08.2025. 17:22

https://www.3dmark.com/3dm/140941912?


Solidan iGPU na mobilnom zenu5. BG3 radi sasvim ok na medium 1080p.

The Exiled 30.09.2025. 21:48

Exploding AMD CPUs | Investigating ASRock's Murderboards:kafa:

Odinarius 01.10.2025. 16:35

Al sam se usrećio :) Mada drugi proc radi u redu.

Tajl3r 01.10.2025. 21:36

Pa šta uru vrimena priče a stvarni uzrok i dalje nepoznat i ne crkaj baš left and right nego svaka "pedeseta" ...i opet smo na pocetku

Poslano sa mog SM-S918B koristeći Tapatalk

The Exiled 01.10.2025. 21:54

ASRock sam ne zna ili ne želi reći točan uzrok, pa je Heavy Metal Steve provel sat vremena u tom osvrtu uz popratne detalje potencijalnih uzroka.

Makar čak i uz sav pozadinski čupajz kojem još uvijek nema kraja - AMD i dalje uredno uvažava sve CPU reklamacije.

stef 03.10.2025. 13:34

Bar nešto pozitivno.
Inače, primijetil sam na svojoj AM4 Extreme4 da po defaultu napucava CPU voltažom, jedina granica je valjda temperaturni trotling. Nakon petljanja s PBOom od kojeg sam na kraju odustao, najbolji se pokazao negativni offset od 0.75.

IMHO, ta automatika s burstanjem voltaže i clocka nije baš pre-pametna, osobito kod neujednačenog i light workload-a. Npr. stare igre za koje i onako nije potreban nikakav burst. Ili stajanje na početnom meniju i sl. Pa zatim Epic Games launcher koji kod downloada prži CPU ... wtf i zašto? Za to sam složio Windows power profil koji ne bursta.

Tako da mislim da si je ekipa i sama kriva za spržene CPUe jer su sve ostavili na defaultu, ili su pak ukucavali "bedaste" vrijednosti. Siguran sam da su ASRock-ove defaultne postavke jako "optimistične".

Odinarius 03.10.2025. 15:16

Ne može netko biti kriv za kvar zato što ga nije preventivno popravio...

Disco 06.10.2025. 12:00

AMD Gains CPU Share as Intel Hits Record Low on Steam September Hardware Survey

Steam survey je rekao bih zakukac...ispada da AMD jedva dostiže Intel, a realna situacija je da su pomeli pod sa njima u zadnjih sigurno 6 godina. Ali pošto ne mijenjaju svi kompove, ima tu još vj hrpetina sandy derivata koji i dalje rade normalno pa ispada ovako kako ispada. Hajde da vidimo za cca godinu kada ga nam gurnu w11 niz grlo i da li će se situacija promijeniti.

I ne, nije vjest negativna po AMD, ali mi je čudno da ispada da i dalje ima više intela kod gejmera (koji su voljni učestvovati u SSu, ja npr svaki put prihvatim kada me pita).

@Stef: ima popriličan broj retardiranih igara koje na meniju nemaju vsync iako ga za igru imaju..pa se GPU i CPU rasdpadaju na max bezveze i slično...

The Exiled 06.10.2025. 12:19

Dobro je da Intel ovaj tjedan službeno najavljuje najavu najave za Panther Lake i 18A proces koji će onda biti predstavljen na CES-u 2026. i u rukama kupaca tijekom ljeta sljedeće godine.

Tak da nisu loše ove Steam ankete, jer realnost je malo zajebanija stavka, pa nije lijepo pričati o mobilnim Panther Lake modelima koji su već trebali biti na tržištu.

Dr. Strange 06.10.2025. 16:14

Još dobrih vijesti od AMD-a: https://zimo.dnevnik.hr/clanak/amd-i...---938671.html

Odinarius 06.10.2025. 16:55

Ovo je više za GPU temu, ali ima smisla i od strane korisnika AI hardvera da se diversificiraju. Vezanje za Nvidiu je najgora stvar koju su mogli napraviti za sebe. Em je usko grlo u deploymentu imati samo jednog proizvođača, em će ih kožnati oderati žive.

The Exiled 06.10.2025. 17:12

Lako moguće da se odvikavanje od nVidijinih rješenja i dodatno ubrza obzirom na ping-pong koji Jensen igra sa svim uključenim stranama.:)
Citiraj:

DeepSeek’s new AI model debuts with support for China-native chips and CANN, a replacement for nVidia's CUDA:sweating:
Citiraj:

Chinese AI firm DeepSeek has released its latest large language model, DeepSeek-V3.2-Exp, with first-day optimizations for Huawei’s Ascend hardware and CANN software stack. The launch marks a shift in priorities to ensure leading-edge models run on domestic accelerators rather than relying on nVidia’s CUDA ecosystem. The sheer speed of adoption here illustrates how China’s AI ecosystem is undeniably preparing for a future in which access to nVidia hardware cannot be taken for granted. nVidia’s CUDA remains dominant for both training and inference, but DeepSeek’s latest release is one of the first from a major Chinese company to apparently arrive optimized for non-CUDA stacks on day one. The coordinated effort across Ascend, Cambricon, and Hygon is the clearest sign to date that Chinese firms are taking Beijing’s demands for AI sovereignty seriously, not just making their hardware compatible after the fact, but positioning domestic platforms as first-class targets.
Izvor: Tom's Hardware

Dr. Strange 06.10.2025. 17:22

Citiraj:

Autor The Exiled (Post 3824292)
Lako moguće da se odvikavanje od nVidijinih rješenja i dodatno ubrza obzirom na ping-pong koji Jensen igra sa svim uključenim stranama.:)

Dobro su neki govorili da je to s Nvidijom balon koji može puknuti bilo kad. Trenutno im ide odlično, Kožnati je finu lovu ugrabio, no Kinezi ubrzano rade na osamostaljenju. AMD nudi sve konkurentniji proizvod, točnije, hardverski su odavno konkurentni, no softverski zaostaju, ali su kupili nekoliko AI softverskih kompanija te sudeći po dogovoru s OpenAI-jem, imaju prilično zrelu platformu. Jensenu nije ugodno, koliko god trenutno izgledao svemoćno. Sve se to može u sekundi raspasti, svjestan je on toga, a ne pomaže mu ni Trump sa svojom politikom zatvaranja i pokazivanja srednjeg prsta svemu što nije američko.

The Exiled 06.10.2025. 17:33

Da, Jensen jako dobro zna da ne može dovijeka držati monopol nad kompletnim tržištem i koliko god se pravi da mu kinesko tržište nije baš neki preveliki gubitak, ipak je svjestan da gubi fini dio kolača. Makar istovremeno hvali sve strane, jer se nikome ne želi zamjeriti, dok im nameće svoje proizvode, nije glup, pa da vjeruje kak još dugo može sjediti na svim stolicama. Kina je kak smo i komentirali diljem raznih tema, ponajviše u kontekstu Intelovih peripetija i tzv. domaće proizvodnje, fino nadigrala i prešišala ostatak svijeta, te im uopće nije problem koristiti svoja domaća rješenja.

kopija 06.10.2025. 17:50

Citiraj:

Autor The Exiled (Post 3824297)
Kina je kak smo i komentirali diljem raznih tema, ponajviše u kontekstu Intelovih peripetija i tzv. domaće proizvodnje, fino nadigrala i prešišala ostatak svijeta, te im uopće nije problem koristiti svoja domaća rješenja.


Ispravka netočnog navoda prvi dio, i drugi dio.


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