PC Ekspert Forum - Intel ARC/Xe GPU

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- - Intel ARC/Xe GPU (https://forum.pcekspert.com/showthread.php?t=299158)

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Autor Dottore (Post 3779747)

:lol2: Prije obrnutno.
TSMC nikada nije imao problema u proizvodnom procesu. Nedavno je desio potres u Tajlandu i oporavljaju brže nego Intel.

Intel je oduvijek imao problema.

Ajde navedi koliko TSMC pokriva proizvođača?

Nvidia i AMD su morali ostati na 28nm, jer 20nm nije bio dobar za grafičke kartice. Dvije generacije na istom proizvodnom procesu.

https://www.extremetech.com/internet...nt-report-says

U Intelu je to godinama lijepo išlo tick-tock metodom, a onda je počelo trokirati.

https://i.postimg.cc/7PW6TbmL/Intel.png

Gledao sam malo testove, u cyberpunku je nešto malo brži od 6700XT, negdje malo sporiji. Ali troši stvarno ništa, tipa 110W, što znači da ima prostora za izdavanje grafe koja bi bilo znatno brža. Po meni je B580 itekako dobrodošla stvar, da kupujem nešto u tom rangu mislim da bi iz fore uzeo.

Dobar je ovaj video sa TSMCom i Philipsom, poučno je. Svakako jedan od razloga što je Europa (osim ASML-a) manje više beznačajna u tom sektoru, a i generalno sve više :D

samo šta od očekivanih cca 250$
kod nas več u linksu 350eu:fiju:

Uvijek je poprilična razlika između cijena preko bare i kod nas. Pretpostavljam i da konkurencija kod njih od 250-300$ ode kod nas na blizu 400€.

250$ je veleprodajna cijena na koju kupac plaća porez na blagajni.

Kanada newegg.ca - B580 240€, 4060 287€, RX 7700 XT 433€
Hrvatska links.com - B580 350€, 4060 360€, RX 7700 XT 500€

Razlika 70€ na prosjeku dvije kartice, znači da treba pričekati da spuste B580 na 300€- 310€ gdje će zapravo imati smisla, vjerovatno voze malo hype da uberu nešta love, ali će brzo skužiti da ne ide.. :chears:

Ne podcjenjivati hype...

znači vozim 3070 i dalje

p.s. mislil sam novo pa 12gb...

Imaju i AMD i nV, AMD ima debelo najmanje, ali ovdje je problem što je ovo grafa za niži rang CPU-a. Sad će oni to kao ispraviti....ma nema šanse uz hrpu drugih problema koje imaju sa driverima od tih GPU-a. Ali ajd, da ne prduckam previše, živi bili pa vidili.

Uz sve kaj je Intel snašlo zadnjih godina, ARC im je još i najmanji problem. I sad ispada da low-end kartica treba high-end CPU, tako da može ponuditi mainstream performanse otprije nekoliko godina. Da stvar bude gora, starije mainstream Radeon i GeForce kartice s kojima se B580 danas natječe, nemaju takvih/tolikih/ikakvih problema kad ih se upari s malo starijim i sporijim procesorima. Zanimljivo kak je Tom Petersen zaboravil te sitnice spomenuti za vrijeme svoje PR turneje.:)

EDIT: ARC B580 je repriza svega već viđenog (1 - 2) s prijašnjom generacijom i nažalost nema mjesta čuđenju, posebice kad im Tom Petersen PR likovi dan-danas prodaju maglu.

Stevica ga malo serucka, otkud je izvukao taj 2600 nije mi jasno. Još prije 2 godine znalo se koji CPU minimalno ide uz Arc a da ne bude problema:

"Minimum system requirements call for a 10th Gen Intel Core or AMD Ryzen 3000 processor. This is due to the Resizable Bar (Intel) and Smart Access function (AMD) being supported only in those versions; this feature is mandatory. Intel's Arc cards appear to be much more feature reliant on your processor, a lack of them will result in lag spikes and a decreased frame rate in games. Earlier review already demonstrated that effect very well. Also mandatory to have at least Windows 10 20H2 (64-bit) installed on a GPT-partitioned hard drive. "

Znači Stevica u nedostatku valjda zanimljivije teme tuče konja mrtvog 2 godine.
Vidim da i ovaj neki yt kreten desno od njega istu stvar radi sa 9600K.

Mislim da je taj CPU tu samo tek-toliko da pokaže kak i taj prastari model koji nema ReBAR podršku, ipak radi OK za RTX 4060, a B580 se lomi, dok je istovremeno najavil dodatna detaljnija testiranja. Izgleda da su svi ti recenzenti zaboravili da su testirali A700 modele i da je ista ReBAR stvar bila s prošlom generacijom. IMHO veći HUB zajeb je u tome da su tjednima (1 - 2 - 3 - 4) odrađivali ARC B580 promo kampanju i uredno ismijavali ljude po komentarima i sad im se vratilo ko bumerang, jer ih se proziva da su ljudi na njihovu i sličnu preporuku kupili najbolju budžet gaming karticu ikad viđenu.:)

To je drugo, ako su preporučivali taj arc bez disclaimera i kao magični štapić za sve gpu probleme :D onda su napravili krivo.
B580 je ipak nov gpu i za očekivati je da će biti kombiniran u novim budget konfama, ne sa procom iz 2018.g.
Ali da, svakako su trebali napomenut u recenzijama kakav CPU je potreban.

Da, nisu ni testirali, automatski ide 9800X3D, 7800X3D ili 14900K, tj. nabolje kaj se nudi, jer većina tih recenzenata ima takve sustave za GPU recenzije, a onda tip sa 14900K isključi ReBAR i ode B580 nizbrdo. Tip iz Hardware Canucks koji je testiral sa 9600K se isto tak referenciral da se pomoću ReBarUEFI skalamerije može pokušati uključiti ReBAR na starijim mašinama, ali da je općenito preporuka takvih alata smiješna. Kaj se Australaca tiče, nažalost Tim, a posebice Steve vole trollati ljude u komentarima, pa kad im se hrpa njih javi da u kojem dijelu svijeta već žive, B580 ne košta 250$ ili se uopće ne može naći, ova dvojica ih poseru i dodatno kroz svoje videe podjebavaju kak su oni provjerili i sve je puno B580 kartica za 250$. Tak da ne bude ništa čudno kad Steve za ovo vrijeme kad su svi na CES-u 2025., snimi još dodatnog ARC B580 materijala s kojekakvim ReBAR ON/OFF CPU kombinacijama.

https://i.postimg.cc/FRBWtXjw/HUB.png

:):D

EDIT:
ARC B580 Overhead Issue, Ryzen 5 3600, 5600, R7 5700X3D & R5 7600: CPU-Limited Testing:kafa:

Na kraju nije toliko loše, ali nije ni dobro kako je u početku izgledalo.
Sve u svemu, Intel se izgleda jako oslanja na sam CPU i vj softversku zamjenu za hrpetinu toga što AMD i nV vj rješavaju hardverski.

Jebiga, kak smo komentirali, budžet kartica koja najbolje radi s high-end procesorima, dok je neki minimum običan R5 7600, a najbitniji dio publike za to mora mijenjati cijelu platformu.

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The Intel Arc B570 becomes most interesting when taking into account its $219 price point and that for Linux users is backed by fully open-source and upstream drivers.

Ima i AMD open source drivere, a ispada da je B580 pandan 7600, s time da je u nekim situacijama i dosta ispod. Meni se kod ovih intel kartica najviše sviđa dizajn, jednostavno i bez gluposti.

Najveći problem je kaj ih izuzev nekoliko američkih dućana, skoro, pa nigdje nema za kupiti, posebice po tim reklamiranim cijenama, a performansama su u rangu prošle i pretprošle Radeon i GeForce generacije donjeg dijela tržišnog segmenta. Obzirom na Intelovu sveopću situaciju i činjenicu da praktički rasprodaju, gase ili zatvaraju sve kaj im stvara trošak, ostaje samo pitanje vremena kad budu se domogli i ARC GPU divizije, jer su puno veći i profitabilniji odjeli otišli u ruke novih vlasnika ili su pak kompletno ugašeni.

Po meni je super imati i treću stranu na tom nesretnom GPU tržištu. Ja, doduše, još uvijek čekama Larabee :D

Da, tak je i ta cijela priča počela, tj. ljudi su na točno taj način čekali nove kartice, ali od prvog dana je sve bilo u rukama prodavača magle od kojih je još samo Tom Petersen u opticaju.

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Intel reportedly abandoned higher-end ARC Xe2 "Battlemage" dGPU project last year:kafa:

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Intel GPU enthusiasts have been waiting patiently for news regarding higher-end models; ever since the launches of wallet-friendly Arc Xe2 "Battlemage" B580 and B570 graphics cards. As the cliché goes; recent silence has been deafening—we last heard about a speculative expanded lineup of B-series SKUs around late January. At the time, three mysterious "Battlemage" PCI identifiers turned up online; courtesy of Tomasz Gawroński's detective work. Opinions were split about the exact nature of these leaked "BMG" IDs; one camp envisioned Team Blue having professional variants of their existing B580 in the pipeline—presumably with generously specced pools of 24 GB VRAM onboard. A more optimistic group posited that Intel's Arc Xe2 desktop gaming family would welcome more potent "B750, B770," and (maybe) "B780" SKUs.

Yesterday, Tomasz Gawroński (aka GawroskiT) interacted with another notable source of inside track information: Jaykihn (jaykihn0). Plenty of Team Blue-related "scoops" have emerged via Jaykihn's social media channel; mostly predictions regarding upcoming desktop, mobile and enterprise CPUs. Their latest leak indicates Intel's alleged abandoning of a high-end/larger "BMG-G31" GPU die in 2024; within the third quarter of that year. Insiders have long insisted that the Arc Xe2 "Battlemage" project navigated choppy waters during development; hence the appearance of endless theories about the whole caboodle being called off. Jaykihn clarified that he believes that a "retail" launch of "BMG-G31" dGPUs will no longer take place. Many watchdogs will assume that a gap will be filled by forthcoming Arc Xe3 "Celestial" discrete GPUs. Jaykihn stated that they have no fresh insights into how that project is going.

Izvor: TechPowerUp

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MSI is expected to utilize AMD’s Ryzen AI Z2 Extreme APU for their next “Claw” gaming handheld, potentially ditching Intel:fiju:

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MSI reportedly plans to release the "Claw" handheld featuring AMD's Ryzen Z2 AI Extreme APU, potentially shifting away from Intel to prioritize high-end performance. With Intel's Lunar Lake "Core Ultra 200V" processors, there weren't many handhelds adopting the lineup, but the one product that did stand out was the MSI Claw 8 AI+ device, which was not only the company's first handheld device, but it was basically one of the first "Core Ultra" gaming handhelds as well. It is claimed that MSI plans to switch towards Team Red for a future handheld release in the Claw lineup, potentially adopting the Ryzen Z2 lineup and ending the exclusivity with Intel's processors.

However, we are unaware of whether MSI will entirely shift to AMD, similar to its competitors like ASUS, or will have a lineup offering both Intel/AMD options, but the latter seems highly unlikely since integrators need to be in an "exclusive" agreement with either of the CPU manufacturers. It is claimed that MSI will utilize the flagship Ryzen Z2 AI Extreme model, an APU that was recently disclosed in a leak. This particular model is said to feature a dedicated NPU engine but is said to be of similar specifications to the Ryzen Z2 Extreme, which comes in a total of 8 cores and 16 threads configuration, maximum boost clock of 5.0 GHz, and a 16-core RDNA 3.5 iGPU. Compared to the Intel Core Ultra 7 258V, the Ryzen Z2 AI Extreme is expected to dominate gaming workloads, which might be one of the reasons why MSI has decided to switch vendors.

For now, nothing is official, but the rumor does show that AMD has managed to attract most of the manufacturers in the handheld segment and has created a dominant market share.

Izvor: Internet

Help us, Intel. You're our only hope:kafa:

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This video is a mix of information gathering and 'talking head' style content. We're reporting on Intel's current position with new information from its Arc GPU partners, plus providing our own commentary and opinions about how Intel's position in the GPU market is more important than it may seem. Intel isn't vying for first -- it's vying for second, and that means someone to keep AMD in check rather than allowing AMD to comfortably sit with status quo. Maybe with the two of them fighting each other, there could be a real chance at better low-end and mid-range GPUs. This is just us talking about it all.

Svaka čast Heavy Metal Steveu na pomalo naivno optimističnom ARC osvrtu, posebice obzirom na aktualno stanje cijele firme, ali bojim se da Intel nije u poziciji da nekome pomognu.

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MSI Claw A8 with Ryzen Z2 Extreme tested: performance rival for Lunar Lake:fiju:

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The brand, previously known for using only Intel chips, is now first to market with a next-generation AMD-based handheld. MSI was the first, and essentially the only major brand, to adopt Meteor Lake for a gaming handheld. However, that version was (simply put) a commercial failure. MSI later upgraded it to use Lunar Lake and even released a new version with a larger 8-inch screen. Despite early setbacks, the Core Ultra 200V-based handheld remains one of the best gaming systems on the market, thanks to its significantly improved Xe2 graphics architecture.

The Ryzen Z2 Extreme also features a newer architecture and now includes RDNA 3.5 graphics, an upgrade from the previous generation’s RDNA 3. The GPU subsystem has also been improved, with the Radeon 890M now offering 16 Compute Units. 2 Extreme delivers strong performance across a wide power range. At 35W, it scores over 3600 points for GPU and 8800 for CPU in 3DMark Time Spy, matching the HX 370 in graphics but trailing in CPU. It clearly outperforms the older Z1E and competes closely with Intel’s Core Ultra 258V, offering better CPU performance but slightly lower GPU results. At 12W, the Z2E surpasses the Z1E by a noticeable margin and nearly matches the 370, pulling ahead in efficiency when total system power is equal. At 25W and above, performance is similar between Z2E and HX 370, with Z2E offering better power efficiency.

In real-world gaming, the Z2E shows strong efficiency, especially in low to mid power ranges. In Ghost of Tsushima at 11-13W, it delivers the highest frame rate and longest battery life at around 3 hours and 40 minutes. In more demanding games like Expedition 33, it maintains over 30 FPS, while the Z1E falls behind. In lighter titles 2E leads at low power levels, achieving up to 8.5 hours of battery life. However, Intel’s 258V still dominates ultra-low-power gaming, maintaining stable 60 FPS at very low wattages and offering up to 11 hours of battery life in some cases.

Izvor: VideoCardz

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Intel opens up XeSS 2 to nVidia and AMD GPUs with SDK 2.1.0:frend:

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Intel on Thursday released the XeSS 2 SDK version 2.1.0, with which it announced support for non-Intel GPUs. This would be any GPU that supports Shader Model 6.4, which are GeForce GTX 10-series "Pascal" or newer from nVidia, and Radeon RX 5000 RDNA from AMD, or newer. The update opens up not just super resolution (XeSS SR), but also frame generation (XeSS FG) and low latency (XeLL), however, using XeLL requires XeSS FG to be enabled, it cannot be exclusively used. The release of XeSS 2 SDK would make it possible for game developers to update their binaries to support XeSS 2, and expose the feature-set to even non-Intel GPUs. At a hardware-level, XeSS 2 would rely on DP4a compute to run its super resolution and frame generation models. Only on Intel Arc "Alchemist" or "Battlemage" GPUs will the technology leverage XMX accelerators.

Izvor: TechPowerUp

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MSI Claw handhelds with Ryzen Z2 Extreme & Intel Lunar Lake tested against one another:fiju:

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The AMD Ryzen Z2 Extreme, which is also the top-of-the-line SoC in the Z2 lineup, is showing noticeably higher performance on the Claw A8 when compared to the Claw 8 AI+. The latter uses the Lunar Lake Ultra 7 258V, an 8-core/8-thread chip based on the TSMC N3B process node, which brings the Eight Xe2-based GPU cores. The Z2 Extreme, on the other hand, is based on the older TSMC 4nm node but offers 8 cores and 16 threads with clocks reaching up to 5.0 GHz. The iGPU is equivalent to the Radeon 890M, bringing 16 compute units based on RDNA 3.5 architecture.

With such improvements on the MSI Claw A8, naturally, gamers will likely pick the Z2-based version for smoother performance, particularly when it offers a higher TDP range, which can go as high as 35W. Nonetheless, Lunar Lake still shows impressive performance and could bring similar or better value if the price for the Claw 8 AI+ is lowered. Up until now, most handheld manufacturers opted for the custom Ryzen APUs and Strix Point chips for their latest handhelds, and the Ryzen Z2 lineup offers a solution for every budget (from 4-core to 8-core APUs). Intel Lunar Lake, on the other hand, doesn't offer versatile options and sticks to only 8-core chips.

Izvor: Wccftech