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Disco 11.04.2022. 13:03



EDIT: Ubio ga 12400f, ali baš me zanima ovaj najavljeni Timov video koji će nam pokazati ipak malo stvarniju sliku.
Tim će složit 2 identična kompa, a razlike će samo biti u pločama i CPUima. Onda će izvuć maksimum iz obje konfe (OC-at) i pogledati potrošnju, zagrijavanje...


Mladenxy 11.04.2022. 17:35

Baš zanimljiva vremena. Za gamere intel izbacio dva vrijedna procesora (IMO) ako ne želiš plaćati nepotrebno, mislim na male jezgre. i3 12100F i i5 12400F, s time da je i3 uvjetno dobar izbor zbog količine jezgri, ali nitko mu ne može osporiti uloženo/dobiveno.
i5 12400F je jednostavno bez mane u svim gamerskim kategorijama, performanse, cijena, zagrijavanje, potrošnja. Kako će se izgleda cijena ploča međusobno približavati AMD sa spuštanjem cijene ryzenu 5600 ne ispada nikakav no brainer.
Jedva čekam testove za 3D keš...baš me zanima ta gaming kruna i cijena. Tko voli nek izvoli naravno
I onda AM4 ak sam dobro skužio, samo DDR 5 koji je i dalje pre skup, uz trend skupih ploča i procesora bude zanimljivo vidjeti koliko bu to ljudima motivirajuće da nadograde trenutne platfome koju sve samo ne spore, iz bilo kojeg tabora unazad par generacija.

The Exiled 11.04.2022. 18:01

AM4 platforma je na zalazu karijere, tak da su ovi firško izdani modeli zadnji trzaji, a kaj se AM5 + DDR5 tiče, na kraju budu oba proizvođača isforsirala novi RAM standard.
Citiraj:

Intel is apparently already asking motherboard makers to avoid using DDR4 in combination with the upcoming 700-series chipsets and the only reason for this would be to speed up the transition to DDR5.
Kak god se okrene opet budu svi skupa zaradili na novim platformama, a korisnicima preostaju postojeća DDR4 rješenja da si iskombiniraju kaj im najbolje paše.
EDIT:
Citiraj:

AMD Ryzen 7 5800X3D gets full set of gaming benchmarks ahead of launch:kafa:
Citiraj:

To spoil the excitement, it's a dead race between the two CPUs in most games at 1080p, with Intel being ahead by about 1-3 FPS in the games where AMD loses out. However, in the games AMD takes the lead, it's by a good 10 FPS or more, with games like the Witcher 3 and Final Fantasy XV seeing an advantage of 40-50 FPS. AMD often has an advantage when it comes to the one percent low numbers, even when Intel is ahead when it comes to the average FPS, but this doesn't apply to all of the games. It's worth keeping in mind that the Intel CPU should gain extra performance when paired with DDR5 memory in some of these games, but we'll have to wait for more reviews to see by how much. The benchmarks displayed are mostly the games TPU normally tests with, but aren't the entirety of games tested by XanxoGaming.
https://i.postimg.cc/jCpJNjvV/3-QV4ol-KYbu7f1-Y0u.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/DSFJjYtB/7-En-CPzhn-LPl1-FIbl.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/5HsCFqKp/7ltym-Kpl-Sc-IJUAHV.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/BLt15Ld3/Eh-DL5-Ox-XUoub2h-AY.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/62S4M6Xv/fs1f2-L4-KUy-MKF4mw.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/rz0rK41C/n-X1-Rsc-Rzhu-QLsr-RH.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/ZWF3JhrG/q-MEy-Wrxwulb-Uo-T9-T.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/VJcnyNb9/RYIg-A...V9-E6-Fr-R.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/p9WjT1Cp/w9-Ouh8-Vti6-ZGSl-ZC.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/sv5GJR0M/y856h-DU3-H2wtb-E8z.jpg
Izvor: TechPowerUp

Citiraj:

AMD Ryzen 7 5800X3D Review - The Magic of 3D V-Cache:kafa:
Citiraj:

AMD is taking a completely different approach with the Ryzen 7 5800X3D, instead of shooting for more MHz, they introduced a technological innovation that is almost as game-changing as the introduction of processor chiplets that enabled the tremendous success of Ryzen Zen 2 and Zen 3. The 3D V-Cache, as AMD calls their new innovation, is a silicon die that consists purely of cache memory, not compute cores or similar logic. A cache in computing is a fast piece of storage that sits in the data transfer path, and that stores pieces of data that are often used (hot data, where the heat represents frequency of access). If the cache is now able to fulfill a request for some data, then no full trip to the main memory is needed, which improves performance, because the cache runs a much greater speed and far better latency than the main memory on your motherboard ever could. A typical modern computer has 16 GB or 32 GB of memory, cache sizes are between 10 MB and 64 MB, so roughly a thousandth (!). On the Ryzen 7 5800X3D, the cache size is 96 MB, as opposed to 32 MB on the Ryzen 7 5800X. This 64 MB increase might not sound like much, even your phone can download that much data in a few seconds, it still has the potential to make a big difference.

It seems that games are an ideal workload for higher cache sizes, which is probably why AMD has been shipping their Ryzen processors with relatively large caches (compared to Intel), even though cache takes up a lot of silicon die area, which costs money. Averaged over our 10 games at the CPU-bottlenecked 720p resolution, the Ryzen 7 5800X3D can gain an impressive 10% in performance over its 5800X counterpart. This is enough to make it the fastest gaming CPU, right behind Intel Core i9-12900K and i9-12900KS. Considering that Intel's Alder Lake comes with a new and improved core architecture, runs almost 1 GHz higher and has faster DDR5 memory, this is an impressive achievement. It also means that Intel has defended their "World's fastest Gaming Processor" claim, but the differences are minimal, when looking at the averages. Individual games will show vastly different results though, the highlights here are Borderlands 3 and Far Cry 5. Borderlands 3, which has been extremely CPU limited in all our testing gains an enormous 43% (!!) in FPS. Far Cry 5 is the most memory-sensitive title in our test suite, +35%, wow! The rest of our games do gain some FPS, but the differences aren't as big. You're probably wondering why Counter-Strike CS:GO is only 5% faster. I suspect it's because the game's hot data already fits into the cache of most processors, so the larger L3 cache doesn't have as much an effect.

Still, even 5% at 1440p is a monumental achievement if you consider that AMD "merely" added more cache and is using the same processor architecture, actually at lower clock speeds. I think it's also important to highlight that we've measured the biggest gains at FPS rates that were already very high in the first place. For example, Borderlands 1080p goes from 97 FPS to 138 FPS. Unless you have a 120 Hz monitor or better, you won't notice the increase in framerate. Latencies might be slightly better though, which could matter to competitive gamers. Due to the way the 3D V-Cache die is stacked on top of the 8-core compute die, all heat has to travel through the 3DV die (and the surrounding structural silicon. When operating at lower voltage, a processor's total heat output will be lower, too. We measured a very reasonable 77°C processor temperature, which is just 2°C above the Ryzen 7 5800X, which runs at higher clocks and voltage, of course. Compared to other Zen 3 Ryzens the heat is concentrated on a smaller area though, because the 5800 uses just a single CCD, whereas the 5900X and 5950X spread the heat over two CCDs. Compared to Intel 12900KS, thermals are a night-and-day difference. While I felt that cooling the Intel chip was a constant challenge, keeping the the Ryzen 5800X3D cool "just works" and no special consideration is needed.
Izvor: TechPowerUp

Old.machine 12.04.2022. 10:22

*delete

Dr. Strange 12.04.2022. 21:43

Citiraj:

Autor The Exiled (Post 3594268)
AM4 platforma je na zalazu karijere, tak da su ovi firško izdani modeli zadnji trzaji, a kaj se AM5 + DDR5 tiče, na kraju budu oba proizvođača isforsirala novi RAM standard.

Kak god se okrene opet budu svi skupa zaradili na novim platformama, a korisnicima preostaju postojeća DDR4 rješenja da si iskombiniraju kaj im najbolje paše.
EDIT:

Prilično impresivno s obzirom da se radi o istoj arhitekturi, dodali samo cache i dostigli Intelovu novu arhitekturu, kakav će tek biti Zen 4 :goood:.

The Exiled 12.04.2022. 21:58

Da, dosta dobro je ispalo, a AMD je taj 3D cache inicijalno planiral za Zen 2, ali nije bilo suđeno, ali ako Zen 4 po defaultu ima i 3D cache barem za veći broj modela - fina bude to situacija.:)

Mladenxy 12.04.2022. 22:15

Intel je trebao umjesto malih jezgri upakirati keš...barem za neki model. Male jezgre su totalna glupost za gamere.
AMD je ovim modelom napravio finu evoluciju.

Dr. Strange 12.04.2022. 22:33

Treba napomenuti da su u toj recenziji za Intel koristili dosta skuplju memoriju, kad bi koristili onu jeftinu koju je imao AMD, razlika u korist AMD-a bi bila još veća.

Mladenxy 12.04.2022. 22:38

Brijem da uz 3D keš memorija pada u deseti plan, to mu je i uloga.

Edit; ipak li la sa i9
https://www.techpowerup.com/review/a...800x3d/15.html

Dr. Strange 12.04.2022. 23:25

Citiraj:

Autor Mladenxy (Post 3594482)
Brijem da uz 3D keš memorija pada u deseti plan, to mu je i uloga.

Edit; ipak li la sa i9
https://www.techpowerup.com/review/a...800x3d/15.html

Nejasan mi je ovaj CS: GO, zašto tolika razlika? stvar optimizacije ili?

Mladenxy 12.04.2022. 23:28

Veći klok.

Dr. Strange 12.04.2022. 23:32

Citiraj:

Autor Mladenxy (Post 3594492)
Veći klok.

Da, gledam baš sad, i 100 mhz veći clock može donijeti oko 10 fps-a, no to su ionako bolesno visoki frejmovi da se ne vrijedi zamarat.

Disco 13.04.2022. 05:55

Moram priznat da i nisam nešto impresioniran(za tih 8-10% razlike u odnosu na 5800x), pogotovo s obzirom na cijenu.
No, sve u svemu za one koji žele naj AMD proc isključivo za igre.

The Exiled 13.04.2022. 07:52

Prema TechPowerUp recenziji, novi 5800X3D je u rangu s Intelovim Core i9-12900K(S) modelima, a svi zajedno su kakvih 10% u odnosu na 5800X po pitanju performansi u igrama.

Kak god se okrene tih 96MB L3 cachea je na godinu i pol staroj arhitekturi s osjetno nižim taktovima napravilo dostatnu razliku da CPU bude u rangu s najboljim kaj Intel nudi.

S tim da 12900KS radi na 5.5GHz, tj. dobrih 1.0GHz iznad 5800X3D i košta duplo više u odnosu na ionak pretjernu cijenu za 5800X3D.

Budemo vidjeli kakvi su 3D cache planovi za Zen 4, ali po svemu sudeći potencijala ima u aplikacijama koje mogu to iskoristiti.

Disco 13.04.2022. 08:57

To da, ovo je više kao nekakav test, a vj i provjera tržišta da se vidi da li su gameri spremni iskrcati lovu za gaming proc.
Nebi mi čudilo da i zen4 ima normalnu i 3DC varijantu istog proca, i to duž cijele ponude. Tu bi mogla biti prava (tj primjetna) razlika za X varijantu, a ne kao do sada. ;)

The Exiled 13.04.2022. 09:52

3D cache bi lako moguće u nadolazećim (Intel i AMD) arhitekurama mogel postati sastavni dio CPU-a bez pardona i onda se samo napravi podjela po modelima, pa svatko odabere kaj mu treba.:)

the_ghost 13.04.2022. 10:20

Pa ako se ne sjecam lose, bio je test od hardware unboxeda jedan gdje su na intelu pokazivali cache/core scaling i da zapravo najvecu razliku radi kolicina cachea (kad bi npr disableao visak corova i vrtio sve proceve na npr 6 corova). Veci clock/broj corova nije tu toliko pomogao.

The Exiled 13.04.2022. 10:33

Da, bilo je tak, a i ovaj novi Raptor Lake bude u odnosu na Alder Lake imal (malo) veću količinu L2 i L3 cachea, tak da si obje strane polako pripremaju teren.

Disco 13.04.2022. 15:57

Nego ima li neki link gdje se mogu vidjeti sve verzije AGESA-e plus možda i changelog. Googlam, ali ne nalazim ništa, čak ne mogu naći ni koja je zadnja izbačena (čini mi se 1.2.0.6c)...

The Exiled 13.04.2022. 16:25

Provjeri da li kaj od ovoga ima kakvu korisnu stavku.:)
Code:

https://github.com/amd/firmware_binaries/blob/master/picasso/PSP/AgesaBLReleaseNote.txt

https://github.com/amd/firmware_binaries/blob/master/picasso/PSP/AblPostCode.h.txt

https://github.com/amd/firmware_binaries/blob/master/cezanne/PSP/AgesaBLReleaseNotes.txt

https://github.com/amd/firmware_binaries/blob/master/cezanne/PSP/PSP_ReleaseNotes.txt

https://github.com/amd/firmware_binaries/blob/master/cezanne/PSP/SmuReleaseNotesCZN.txt

Citiraj:

AGESA 1207 microcode will deliver performance gains for AMD's Ryzen 7 5800X3D

Blue Spirit 14.04.2022. 15:32

HU ... za prvu ruku samo 8 igara, sljedeci tjedan bit ce ih 30+



https://i.imgur.com/Viz9JrY.png https://i.imgur.com/WWHr5dI.png

Dr. Strange 14.04.2022. 15:43

Citiraj:

Autor Blue Spirit (Post 3594830)

Crni dan za Intelovce :lol2:.

Old.machine 14.04.2022. 15:46


Mladenxy 14.04.2022. 16:55

Bravo AMD samo ne znam zakaj bi dao te pare pored i5 12400F ili Ryzena 5600. tko voli nek izvoli.

Disco 14.04.2022. 17:00

Citiraj:

Autor Mladenxy (Post 3594842)
Bravo AMD samo ne znam zakaj bi dao te pare pored i5 12400F ili Ryzena 5600. tko voli nek izvoli.

Ovo je kategorija 12900K, KS, dakle za odlikaše. ;)
Kategorija u koju se ja ne mješam. :D
Nego gledam te grafove i potrošnju i moram priznati da nije neka razlika, 50-70w, mislim dosta je to, ali troši li komp 550 ili 620w je IMHO svejedno....ova moja bijeda troši jedva 270-320w(sa monitorom, u igrama).

Mladenxy 14.04.2022. 17:06

Je, kategorija za odlikaše ali treba znati i stat na loptu, ne gurat ko sivonja :D

ansha 14.04.2022. 17:09

Citiraj:

Autor Disco (Post 3594844)
Ovo je kategorija 12900K, KS, dakle za odlikaše. ;)
Kategorija u koju se ja ne mješam. :D
Nego gledam te grafove i potrošnju i moram priznati da nije neka razlika, 50-70w, mislim dosta je to, ali troši li komp 550 ili 620w je IMHO svejedno....ova moja bijeda troši jedva 270-320w(sa monitorom, u igrama).

12700K je dosta jeftiniji a identican performansama 12900-tki, njega treba usporedjivat sa 5800X3D...

The Exiled 14.04.2022. 20:21

Da, ali ...
Citiraj:

Autor The Exiled (Post 3594512)
96MB L3 cachea je na godinu i pol staroj arhitekturi s osjetno nižim taktovima napravilo dostatnu razliku da CPU bude u rangu s najboljim kaj Intel nudi.

... osim toga muljator Elon Musk je upravo najavil da kupuje AMD, čisto da pomogne i toj sirotinji od firme.:):D

MadBoY 14.04.2022. 23:18

Što li će tek biti ako AMD izda Zen4 5.0 GHz cpu s 3D cacheom... :)

Mladenxy 15.04.2022. 06:13

Citiraj:

Autor MadBoY (Post 3594899)
Što li će tek biti ako AMD izda Zen4 5.0 GHz cpu s 3D cacheom... :)

8/16 550$?


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